@john555
Yes i know, you are talking about end points or outcome of a performance..not the stripping process.
It has nothing to do with an act ending with the model wearing waders in her performance, for instance.

If you want an explanation of Totem's definition of 'Full Nudity', it was prescribed as a card/clip tag category a long time ago when the owners percieved a European Strip Club notion of 'Full Nudity' to include shoes and maybe other things.
This certainly does not apply in many other regions of the world and as far as online Adult services go in Europe now , it no longer applies there also. In fact in webchat today one pays tokens for shoes to be put on. It is seen as a 'fetish' and has a price.

So 'Full Nudity' is bound up in the early card tagging system and because so many cards have been produced / catalogued since then, its true that Totem's card coding system cannot be back tracked & reworked to something different without having to deal with overwhelming prohibitive labour costs, interuptions, & delays vetting & changing everything. Enough downside possibly to break the company.

if you want the entire explanation search 'Full Nudity' in the Forums and you will find a wealth of explanation. If Totem could do everything from scratch again, in hindsight, I'm sure they would do it differently. The ostensible Tag names remain purely because of a legacy coding difficulty as far as I know.

@Chiksans, not a card 'rating' system per se...more of a card/clip agreed 'eroticism levels' coding standard.
Shheeesh, no wonder peeps get ***** ;-/
Btw, imho we also should avoid calling customer card Comments ~'Ratings". Maybe better to refer to them as ' Reviews'

@EverthangForever I agree and I would just wish the same, in hindsight, I'm sure they would do it differently. I don't have a problem with the labeling as I consider Categories as well. In that way I am really not deceived. My only concern was the topic drifting towards just shoe on/off. Anyway, you made total sense.

yes we understand - but you should also understand that the label "full nudity" used by Totem is not a description of the card. It is just a name used for a level of eroticness. This has been explained many times here. It is, in my opinion, a poorly chosen name because it does ***** some users.

@TheEmu I agree, makes sense.

Which should be the new norm for all upcoming clips.

Which is why I pointed out it may be impractical for certain types of shoes (i.e. in this case Bonnie's but there are other examples).

In Bonnies case in my opinion there is enough bare flesh on view to consider it fully nude, despite the fact that she keeps the sandals on.

I understand what the bare feet tag means.

Fully nude in this context is Totem's classification of fully nude.

This does not necessarily include bare feet, belts, garters, suspenders or jewellery.

What about the girls who don't shave. Is it not fully nude unless their pubic hair is removed?

What about tatoos - do they need to remove them off as well? After all they are covering up certain parts of flesh.

The debate around fully nude can be somewhat pedantic I prefer a broad definition rather than a proscribed version.

If I can be confident that fully nude means at least a view of the girl showing her arse, tits and pussy then I am reasonably happy. If this also includes every item of clothing, shoes, jewellery, etc. removed then that is also fine.

Other than that I don't really care and,therefore actually disagree with your post as being too restrictive.

@john555

iStripper advertises 'bare feet' as Real Full Naked. Any card that is tagged as bare feet, the model fully unclads ultimately. Check it out, that is why I mentioned bare feet.

Can you give us the evidence When & Where iStripper advertised bare feet as real full naked ? Please, prove what you said is true, otherwise I wonder whether this topic at the beginning is a farce or not.

What about the girls who don't shave. Is it not fully nude unless their pubic hair is removed?

What about tatoos - do they need to remove them off as well? After all they are covering up certain parts of flesh.

The debate around fully nude can be somewhat pedantic I prefer a broad definition rather than a proscribed version.

@Number6 Haha, your examples make me laugh they are insane. I hope I do have some sanity left to explain what is full nudity to you.

1) How do think you would get inside a shower for a bath?
2) After you jump inside a pool, exclude whatever that is soaked or affected by water. I mean remove everything that absorbs water.
3) How do you make love?

For all of the above, if not at least one of the above 3 points should give you a perception of what full nudity is. Guys I am 100% sane explaining what's full nudity to @Number6 😀😀😆

Feel free to ask more questions, like the old man says, 'I can do this all day'.

Nay th@ Ok!!!

@gkar45 do you also have the same question as Number6 buddy?

Ha ha ha. Looks like someone got ***** with some subtle British rhetorical humour delivered masterfully be @Number6

@john555 , where does this term 'real full nudity' and its acronym RFN actually come from? Does Totem really advertise using such terms?

@John555 - No matter how the terms are defined, and now that we completely understand what you are asking it still comes down to you asking that a particular preference of yours, i.e. that every last piece of clothing is removed, is made a feature of every card but that similar preferences of others (e.g. that shoes or stockings stay on) should therefore not get this privileged status.

I think everybody that has contributed to this thread has understood what it is about - except perhaps you. Some of us have been trying to explain why we regard your idea as a poor one.

@john555 , where does this term 'real full nudity' and its acronym RFN actually come from? Does Totem really advertise using such terms?

It is an acronym

It is an acronym

Yes, I know it is an acronym. I even stated that it is an acronym in my question.

It is an acronym
Yes, I know it is an acronym. I even stated that it is an acronym in my question.

Sorry I clicked send before even completing the message fully.

It is an acronym used by many members here since, when iStripper labels cards as 'Full Nudity', they are not always full nudity as the models don't get certain outfits off their body. Therefore the term RFN was coined to give a little more clarity on that subject. Real full nudity is used by memebers in comments area mostly to suggest that the model strips everything off.

Well, to be pedantic RFN is not an acronym - it's an initialism. True acronyms are pronounable words like "radar" or "Nasa", but the distinction between the two is pretty well much ignored nowadays

Well, to be pedantic RFN is not an acronym - it's an initialism. True acronyms are pronounable words like "radar" or "Nasa", but the distinction between the two is pretty well much ignored nowadays

You are correct, RFN is just an abbreviation of Real Full Nudity and not an Acronym. You really did google this didn't you @TheEmu

@John555 - no I did not Google it, it is something I was taught many years ago.

@John555 - no I did not Google it, it is something I was taught many years ago.

@TheEmu Appreciate that!

Sorry, but I barely made it through grade 8 and was never taught such nuances as initialisms and acronyms.

It has also been verified by members here with far more prestige than I can ever hope to have that Full Nudity in the iStripper card descriptions list is an expression of erotic level only.

I can also gather from the previous statements made in this particular thread that the initialism RFN and its expansion Real Full Nudity are terms used by experts on the arts of exotic dancing and erotic entertainment who are in the iStripper membership.

It is therefore safe to assert that the terms Real Full Nudity and RFN are not in the Totem nomenclature, and there is nothing officially advertised claiming that such acts are part of the content.

Sorry, but I barely made it through grade 8 and was never taught such nuances as initialisms and acronyms.

It has also been verified by members here with far more prestige than I can ever hope to have that Full Nudity in the iStripper card descriptions list is an expression of erotic level only.

I can also gather from the previous statements made in this particular thread that the initialism RFN and its expansion Real Full Nudity are terms used by experts on the arts of exotic dancing and erotic entertainment who are in the iStripper membership.

It is therefore safe to assert that the terms Real Full Nudity and RFN are not in the Totem nomenclature, and there is nothing officially advertised claiming that such acts are part of the content.

You have just answered your own question, so what?

My statement was for the benefit of any interested parties that might be reading these exchanges. It may convince those persons that you are chasing your own tail.

My statement was for the benefit of any interested parties that might be reading these exchanges. It may convince those persons that you are chasing your own tail.

@Chicsans I don't have a tail and I don't chase em. I don't care what you are trying to prove to others, I am a spectator.

True acronyms are pronounable words like "radar" or "Nasa", but the distinction between the two is pretty well much ignored nowadays

This is particularly true within the US DOD where vowels are arbitrarily added to pronounce the unpronounceable.

True acronyms are pronounable words like "radar" or "Nasa", but the distinction between the two is pretty well much ignored nowadays
This is particularly true within the US DOD where vowels are arbitrarily added to pronounce the unpronounceable.

I am sure they add words in some cases so that they can actually get an acronym.

A while ago I worked for a company that did a lot of work for a Nuclear Power Plant. I had to go on some training courses. At one of these we were presented with a document of several pages entitled TLA.

It was a list of Three Letter Acronyms (their definition) that were allowed to be used in documents, drawings, etc.

@Number6 Haha, your examples make me laugh they are insane. I hope I do have some sanity left to explain what is full nudity to you

Unfortunately the Forum isn't equipped with a sarcasm mode.

1) How do think you would get inside a shower for a bath?

Usually butt naked, altough when I was much, much younger there was the odd occasion where the bath has been occupied by a naked woman and I have dived in fully clothed.

Also when I am having a bath or I shower I am not removing my clothes for the entertainment of others.

2) After you jump inside a pool, exclude whatever that is soaked or affected by water. I mean remove everything that absorbs water.

At our local pool you have to wear bathing costumes removing them would probably get you arrested.

But again in this case I am not removing my clothes for the entertainment of others. I would be removing them because I am wet.

3) How do you make love?

***** hell mate!! You have led a somewhat sheltered life if you think you have to be naked to have sex. Undoing one's zip and pulling a girl's panties aside is all thats needed in some situations.

For all of the above, if not at least one of the above 3 points should give you a perception of what full nudity is. Guys I am 100% sane explaining what's full nudity to @Number6 😀😀😆

All your posts tell me that a) You keeping wanting to move the goalposts and b) You do not appear to understand Totem's definitions of Full Nudity and Nudity.

They are erotic levels defined by them to help customers who want to know how explicit a card is going to be.

Full Nudity generally means a girl will open her legs and expose her pussy - even if only for a second or two. She may not even be fully naked. Nudity just means that a Girl may remove her panties (and possibly other items) but does not give an explicit view of her pussy.

To go back to your original post, like many others I do not see barefeet as being a complete pre-requisite for a girl to be fully naked. Yes sometimes it is nice to see feet, other times not necessarily so. You wish to impose your narrow views as a definition of fully naked.

I do not accept that. I prefer a broader definition, where girl can occasionally keep on items such as boots and stockings which I find mildly erotic.

The arguement now just seems to be going around in circles and has become somewhat piontless.

TLA's are the norm within DOD although most of them are not really acronyms. The really hard-core types now speak two-letter terms phonetically. Continue the Mission = ***** Mike. Flat Tire = Foxtrot Tango

I am sure they add words in some cases so that they can actually get an acronym.

Worse yet, they often start with a word and find the words to fit. The National Guard has a system called PRIDE = Planning Resource for Infrastructure Development and Evaluation. I never can remember what the letters mean.

In the early 1970's I created an Instructional Resource Management System. The boss called is a can of erms.

There are 6 erotic levels
Level 0 has not been used except once.

Level 1
Level 2
Level 3
Level 4
Level 5

these levels are coded in to the Naming of the clips.
It is the third digit from the right, in a clip name.

the levels have a definition of what erotic activity is allowed to be seen.

to make it more User friendly.
Words have been selected that approximates what you can expect to see
in a particular Level

Words added to make them more user friendly
Level 1 - No Nudity
Level 2 - Topless
Level 3 - Nudity
Level 4 - Full Nudity
Level 5 - XXX

The Levels are more about Erotic Behavior, then just the Level of Undress.
Level 0 - What you would expect to see in a public place. Walking out in Public.
Level 1 - No Naked bits and nothing to sexually suggestive
Level 2 - anything that is more then Level 1, but not level 3
Level 3 - erotic activity that can not be seen in Level 2 , but is not Level 4
Level 4 - this level you might get a clear view of the inner lips, or arse spread open. But not enough to make it level 5
Level 5 - this is the highest level and usually means, some type of insertion happened.

Note: none of the levels, specifically call out, that the Model must remove all of her clothes.


Fully clothed examples
A model touching herself over her clothes, , grabbing her breasts or her pussy briefly, is a level 2
A model putting her hands under her waist band and briefly rubbing and touching herself is a level 3
A model putting her hands down between her legs, under her waist band,
and rubbing herself almost to a climax while fully clothed would be a level 4 clip.

The level descriptions are more detailed than above, but none of them, require that the model be naked.

One last quick question @john555

How would you classify the attached screenshot?

The girl (the lovely Sofie Lilith if anyone is interested) is completely naked but is only showing her rather nice arse.

Just curious.

With respect to acronyms and other abreviations. In the past I have been particularly amused by the phrase "a four letter TLA" (for those who may not be familiar with the initialism TLA the T means three)

And then ofcourse there are recursive acronyms, the most well known of which is Gnu which stands for

Gnu is Not Unix

which expands to

Gnu is Not Unix is Not Unix

and so on.

One last quick question @john555

How would you classify the attached screenshot?

The girl (the lovely Sofie Lilith if anyone is interested) is completely naked but is only showing her rather nice arse.

Just curious.

That's what I am talking about, she is one of my favourites. Great art work, did you do it @Number6?

I would classify the image as 'Full Nudity'. However if she was body painted I would say just 'Nudity'.

The level descriptions are more detailed than above, but none of them, require that the model be naked.

@Wyldanimal That is why I think that the system is flawed and is my concern. Each one of the levels should have a sub category that says 'Real Full Nudity', 'Full Nudity', 'Nudity', 'Partial Nudity' etc.