europeangaming.eu/portal/compliance-updates/2020/…


"If a product looks like gambling and feels like gambling, it should be regulated as gambling"


oh dear...

There might be some of that "we want a cut" but the big push has been based out of the video game space where it essentially is taking advantage of people (there is a reason there is age limits on when you can go to a casino most places in the world).

There is also issues like we see here where there is no really check and balance to the odds of the games where you are taking a companies word for it.

Eventually it will be regulated and then we will see if it applies to this product or not.

Strongly agree. Loot boxes are gambling. And rewards like "special events" cards as rewards for gambling is almost worse than money. It's like being offered a unicorn for a spin of a slot machine. If you can't spot the sucker at the table, you're the sucker.

I like the gambling games. Sometimes I win, Sometimes I lose.

When I don't want to spend money, then I stop playing.

I like the gambling games. Sometimes I win, Sometimes I lose. When I don't want to spend money, then I stop playing.

Except heres the thing. If everyone was like you half the casinos would be out of business and EA wouldnt even have loot boxes anymore.

@wisc4fun

If everyone was like you

Gladly we are all Individuals > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHbzSif78qQ 😉

half the casinos would be out of business

People who are visiting Casinos, are doing it not because only for Gambling.
They are enjoying the Atmosphere of it, meeting other People,
search for like-minded people, sharing their passion and so on so on ....
Like all of us on iStripper ... think about it 😉

Also the following Fact's:

Not every Friday is a Gambling Game!
It is obviously visible, that you can Buy Stripshows with your virtual Credits on iStripper!
The Product is called iStripper and not Casino Royale!
Totem needs to Earn Money, for our continuous Wish for new Content!

Without extra Money, no more Content, no more Shows for anybody,
Nope not a nice Imagination in my Opinion.
When you are spending your Money, you have everytime the Full Control,
how much Credits you can Buy and how much Credits you will spend.
Regardless for new Shows or an TGIF-Event.

But loosing your Control about that, can be a bad End for someone, that's right.
But Totem is not here to take care about this Situation, there are other ways to get help with that.
Keyword: personal Responsibility!

and EA wouldnt even have loot boxes anymore.

Totem is not EA, so you're comparing Apples to Pears.
Also EA is not in Europe > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_Arts

So you can't compare the Lootbox Situation with the Games on iStripper to 100% in my Opinion.
Otherwise bring us some serious Fact's, and we will see.
But please speak before with your Attorney at Law, to completely avoid misunderstandings.

We are her to have Fun, Life is to Short for ***** 😉

Guess what EU laws are ***** EA to change their games not the US. Also totem and EA both put out entertainment software and include gambling style mechanics inside of them as a primary or only way to earn certain items (in fifa its player cards, sound familiar). So EA and Totem are similar in their business just EA has a much larger revenue stream.

Also being an individual is fine but many individuals are unable to control their impulses. It's why there a rules and regulations in most countries and no it's not all about the money, if it was they could easily allow payment via CC and such. Hence my comment on if everyone was like that person we wouldn't have these issues as everyone would have 100% full self control.

BTW Vegas without gambling would possibly be a dust hole right now as there is no redeeming characteristic of the landscape compared to even the California coast which is a couple hours away (which is nothing in the US).

As far as why people go to casinos there are tons of gambling exclusive establishments and gambling machines thrown in to restaurants in the US. I have one right down the road that has a small room with 5 machines and nothing else, people go there specifically to gamble. Have Indian Casinos in my area that a huge but against its exclusively gambling and while one of them has entertainment its a 1-2 nights a week thing last I had checked but possibly has some no name band that plays at your local pub already.

In addition there are laws going in place or being talked about which highly likely will impact totem.

Also ***** me a river on needing to use predatory mechanics to boost revenue. It's not illegal so they can do it if they want but there is a reason why gambling is regulated and its not just because of the money.

I have said it before for me personally I would just like odds to be posted and followed. That is my basic request. I will get in to the weeds on the topic though especially when tries to shift what potential blame might be on Totem off because "totem is not EA".

Totem can choose what they want to do. For me I am not boycotting or banning or anything like that over the practice. I do agree though it should be changed through legal reform to include it in gambling regulation.

Totem, EA, and others want to use gambling mechanics? That's fine then follow the rules casinos are upheld to.

Not sure anyone can disagree with my only requirement though to just post odds.

Finally no not all games are gambling. I never said that. Totem is not evil either. Also the benefit of what totem does also precludes those younger as well. I am simply calling out the topics that many on this forum have zero knowledge of compared to those in the video game community since these discussions have went on longer.

Sorry last thing they can keep SEC on a random chance forever. I personally don't really care and that is not the reason for my additions to these discussions.

@wisc4fun
So ya ... i think i put my Energy back into something nice, or what feels good to me.
Good Luck with your ... whatever you want to Achieve 👍
But i stay on my Opinion that we are her to have Fun, not wasting our Time with such Discussions 😉

@wisc4fun
So ya ... i think i put my Energy back into something nice, or what feels good to me.
Good Luck with your ... whatever you want to Achieve 👍
But i stay on my Opinion that we are her to have Fun, not wasting our Time with such Discussions 😉

You will notice I am not ***** about the gambling games and my only request is a simple odds list.

I see you are fine trying to refute my intial post but when incorrectly (IMO) stating multiple things (although they may be correct for your personal experience and your direct vicinity) you then try to act like its a waste of time.

You will notice as the topic does pop up I will respond to it. I am trying to bring correct information and results of discussions that have spanned years already in other areas.

I am buying from Totem, I purchased in the joker slot machine (more of a poker guy myself lol), and I am not really changing anything personally other than giving my feedback to the conversations that may come up. My hope as well though is that if they do see people talking about it they may proactively change in a manner that allow them to avoid any new laws at the same time making a bunch of money for the work they do.

I miss old vegas.

low prices on hotels, meals, etc.

casinos would bring you in knowing you would spend money on the games. now they charge for everything... When I go, I spend less gambling because I spent the money before I arrived at the table.

not the same...

@wisc4fun You will notice I am not ***** about the gambling games and my only request is a simple odds list.
you wouldn't like them

Oh, I don't know about that... It might let me know that the world is against me!!!

Totem, EA, and others want to use gambling mechanics? That's fine then follow the rules casinos are upheld to.

@wisc4fun You will notice I am not ***** about the gambling games and my only request is a simple odds list.
you wouldn't like them

^^ Both of these comments are the key things here. I stopped putting credits into any of the 'random' type Totem games simply because the odds of winning anything more than credits to cover the last spin seem ridiculous. That doesn't mean I have an issue with Totem having these games - I just won't be playng them (but still agree they should follow gambling regs).

I stopped putting credits into any of the 'random' type Totem games simply because the odds of winning anything more than credits to cover the last spin seem ridiculous. That doesn't mean I have an issue with Totem having these games - I just won't be playng them (but still agree they should follow gambling regs).

Good choice.
If people want to play games, then let them play.
If people don't, then don't.

@gkar45

what you do with them is up to you...

Absolutely, and also under Point IV from the T&C it should be very clear.
Specifically this Sentence, which is written in capital Letters.

YOU FURTHER ACKNOWLEDGE AND AGREE THAT THE CREDIT SYSTEM HAVE
NO MONETARY VALUE AND CANNOT BE REDEEMED FOR CASH.
NO REFUNDS WILL BE MADE FOR THE PURCHASE OF CREDITS.

I think we are all grown up to Understand that, and when you don't know what to do with your Credits:

Simply keep them.

Keep them for an Offer without Gambling mechanics.

Or spend them in the Girls Store, to enjoy some nice Shows.

A simple Solution, is always a smart Choice.

@gkar45

thats just to much to except

You could also say, the Expectation leads to Disappointment which has never changed so far.
But anyway, we will see where all this ends for the Gamblers or Totem,
and which Law comes to play. And as usual, our Crystalballs will stay in Repair forever.

@wisc4fun You will notice I am not ***** about the gambling games and my only request is a simple odds list.
you wouldn't like them

Here is the thing the whole reason casinos in many locations are required to have odds posted is to inform. This allows the statement "personal responsiblity" mean more as they are informed.

I am not saying this is the case but odds also are a way of keeping the house honest. There was a post a couple months back where specific prizes were removed mid-weekend from a scratch game (can't remember all the details). EA has also been accused of this in the past and possibly even tilting odds in favor of those who had a social media precense (Totem could do so in favor of those posting on forums more, I am not saying they are doing this but its important to understand why rules and regulations exist).

What many people seem to lack the understanding for is that gambling and the marketing around it are directly tailored to get more money from an individual than they would otherwise be conmfortable doing. Yes personal responsibility is key. At the same time predatory practices are outlawed in many locations for the wellbeing of the general population.

I mean otherwise why have really any laws then since you can say if you are speeding and crash or crash in to someone else that is your responsibility.

Brought up before but its funny how these comments remind me of posts from 4-5 years ago on video game forums and slowly people came around to wanting regulations because they understood if we are regulating a casino there is no difference to these software companies.

Nobody would like them, that is the main reason why they should be posted everytime. But I don't care, because I do not participate in any gambling events. I know very well those odds are very strongly against participants and in favor of the house. That is the first rule of gambling and the reason why is gambling regulated.

If you want to know your chances to win for example 1000 cr in a Slot machine, they must be much much lower than 1 in 1000 spins or else they would be losing money, obviously.